MSM

Competitive Comparison

Cardinal Associates, Inc.

B & B International
Exclusive Agents For
The United States
And Canada

Representing a Factory
Capable of producing 5,000+ tons of MSM per annum

Quantities up to one ton
Immediately Available From Inventory
In California

Call
800 225-2308
or eMail

On October 16, 2000 I received the following eMail message:

[Karl Note:  I apparently had the wrong name, but the data below still applies to the "Cardinal" that makes MSM, at the address whosn above.]

This is a page about Cardinal  Associates, Inc., apparently one of the only two manufacturers of MSM located in the United States.  I've written this in a first-hand, personal style, within minutes after a fascinating phone call between myself, Karl Loren, and R. Grant Bergstrom, of Cardinal Associates.  I am also writing this in the form of a "statement" which I would be pleased to "declare to be true, under penalties of perjury."  In other words, I intend to stand for the accuracy of every word written here.

This story starts in the fall of 1998 when I decided to become the agent for a foreign factory producing MSM.  Of course I wanted to check out the competition.  Many of the pages you will find on this web site were gathered in that time period.  I simply entered "MSM" or "methyl sulfonyl methane" or other variations in various search engines and spent tens of hours analyzing all the web sites I could find.  Many of those web sites are represented on this site.

At the time I didn't even know the actual names of ANY manufacturers.  I found several web sites which included the words "manufacturer" in their text, but they looked like just any other distributor.

Gradually I learned more and more, and finally learned that the two manufacturers of MSM in the US are Cardinal Associates, Inc., of Vancouver, Washington, and Carolwood in Pennsylvania.  I found web sites listed under "Cardinal Associates" but they were obviously NOT manufacturers (unless Cardinal is selling

For instance, click here for a web site appearing to be Cardinal Associates, but is nothing more than a free link site.  There were actually about 7 different web sites found on Google! on February 10th, but no longer showing up when you clicked on through.  That simply suggests that someone who is selling MSM used the name "Cardinal Associates" and got a free link on this site.  After some number of days the link expires and you can't find the original source any more.

During that period I did finally get an address for both Cardinal and Carolwood.  Carolwood has a web site, but I couldn't find one for Cardinal.  So, I simply wrote a letter to Cardinal asking them for a quotation on their bulk MSM.

I never got an answer from Cardinal, for many weeks.

Then, out of the blue, I got a form letter dated December 29, 1998, from Cardinal, addressed to "Dear Purchasing Manager/Owner."

It offered MSM at $16.75 per kg in quantities of 120 kg.

By that time my own web site was up, and I had a slightly higher price than $16.75 for that quantity, so I lowered my price to the present price.  I announced the reason for that price reduction at the time.  See the announcement dated January 6, 1999.

Then, time went on.

Next, I received by mail that wonderful book, The Miracle Of MSM.  It was sent as a complimentary gift from Cardinal Associates, Inc., Mr. R. Grant Bergstrom!

Included with the book was an offer to sell me a bulk quantity of these books at $5.50 each, plus $ .50 shipping.  I found that this book was being offered on Amazon.com at $13.97 and placed a link to Amazon in these pages.  You will probably have seen that link.

I haven't even finished reading that book, but so far I find it to be quite good.  I decided to call and order 50 copies and either sell them or give them away.

So, I called Cardinal!

I talked with Grant Bergstrom.  I found that conversation quite interesting and will give you the data directly as he told me.  During this phone conversation I was absolutely truthful with him, about my name, company and the retail packages of MSM sold by Vibrant Life, and where Vibrant Life obtained those capsules.  I did NOT tell him that B&B International was selling bulk MSM.

It appears that the offer to sell these books at $5.50 included some strings that were not stated in the offer -- but never mind!

Grant made it quite clear that the books were intended, at this special low price, only for people who were selling Cardinal's MSM.  He asked me where I got my MSM.  I told him the name of our contract packager, from whom I got my MSM capsules.  (These capsules were purchased before I knew about the Indian source.) 

He asked me for the name of that company.  I gave it to him.  He indicated that he would call them and see about their getting their MSM from Cardinal.  It sounded to me like I would only get those books at that special price if my supplier was using Cardinal MSM, or promised to buy from Cardinal next time.

Nothing bad about that -- just normal corporate selling!

I began to wonder if this whole book was financed by Cardinal since Grant made such a big deal out of the patents which Cardinal has from the authors of that book.  But, that doesn't make it a bad book in any event.  [Later I had someone from Carolwood claim that THEY had financed the book!]

During this conversation Grant claimed that Carolwood (specifically named) was not licensed to make MSM, that ONLY Cardinal was the legitimate source under the licenses.  I did not disagree with him at that point.  He told me he wanted to send me copies of all the patents to prove that no other company was legally entitled to sell MSM.

He said that there was only one other company in the world (not in the US) which had these licenses.

I asked him if there were any additives in his MSM.  He admitted that they put "silicon dioxide" in their MSM, at the rate of 1/10 of 1%, to make it flow better in the capsule machines.

He told me that his factory was the only factory which made ONLY MSM, and that the "other" factory made other products and that there was considerable danger of "cross contamination" with the different products being made in the same plant.

He finally named "Carolwood" specifically as a firm that had "violated the patents and had a court decision against them."  He said that Carolwood was selling an "unlicensed" product, and indicated that there was a court decision against Carolwood.

This will be interesting to pursue.  I have also talked to someone at Carolwood.  He was very friendly and told me about this court case.  It had to do with a claim by someone that the word "Adaptin" belonged to someone else and that Carolwood had been using that word, and had agreed to stop using it.  The Carolwood source indicated that Cardinal was well-known as extremely aggressive with lawsuits and very negative attacks on its competitors and on people  who buy from any other source than Cardinal.

He also said that his MSM was made in a "food grade plant."  I asked him about "pharmaceutical grade" status and he didn't know about that.

Well, that was all fine.  The man from Cardinal told me that he couldn't yet agree to sell me those books until he checked out my MSM supplier and talked with his boss.

The man from Cardinal called back about an hour later.  In that time he had found this web site.

You could say that he was a bit brisk with me on that conversation.

He really got assertive, then, saying that I should realize that any MSM I might be selling, from India, was not licensed and was therefore illegal.

I pointed out to him that I had all the patents already published on my web site and that they were "use" patents, not "manufacturing" patents.  I let him know that a "use" patent cannot prevent anyone from manufacturing the substance and that such a patent is extremely weak in terms of any enforcement.

It is certainly true that Cardinal, if they are licensed by the patent-holders, who are also the authors of the book now being promoted, can advertise that they are the "licensed manufacturers" of MSM.  It would also be true, but rather misleading, to say that Carolwood, or any other factory, "making MSM without a license."  But, "making MSM without a license from those patent-holders" would not be any violation of the law, and not even an ethical matter.

One of those patents, for instance, shows that the inventor claims (and he got a patent on this!!!) that MSM, in some sort of liquid/lotion, can be rubbed under the nose, just before sleep, and that it will stop a person from snoring!  That's great.

There is no way that Cardinal can prevent anyone from rubbing MSM under their nose at night -- to stop snoring!

Use patents are typically obtained when there is no possibility of getting a "real" patent, such as a manufacturing patent.  A manufacturing patent typically says that the patent-holder is the ONLY one allowed to MAKE the product using the technique described in the patent.

I have talked with certain larger users of MSM -- people who you would recognize -- people who have signed deals apparently with Cardinal.  It will be interesting to watch as this market develops, as between this web site with a totally open price structure, and the old traditional way of "private deals" and "under the counter discounts" which are never public.

Well, you can watch these pages for the latest developments, but if you are serious about MSM, then you should buy it here -- we have the best published price on the web and our quality is as good as it gets!

Click Here To See Our MSM Prices

                                This page is copyright © May 20, 2008 6:24 AM by B&B International.  All rights are reserved.

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