-----Original Message-----
From: David Friedman [mailto:docneuro@bellsouth.net ]
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 9:22 PM
To: Dan Yelovich
Cc: karl@karlloren.com
Subject: DR. FRIEDMAN'S RESPONSE TO KARL LOREN'S REVIEW ON SEASILVER
Importance: High
Dan,
I hope this finds you well. Thank you for forwarding to me Karl Loren’s negative review on Seasilver. I have gotten over a dozen angry e-mails from Seasilver distributors regarding this very bias review.Interesting fact: Around six years ago, I placed an article I wrote about Seasilver on a few health related bulletin boards on the internet. One day, I received an e-mail from a Mr. Karl Loren who told me he was "very impressed" with what I wrote and asked if I would grant him permission to include my article in his internet newsletter, "The Wednesday Letter."
[Karl Note: Several possibilities here. My best bet is that he is simply lying. I do not recall every reading any such article. It has generally never been my practice to write to an author and request permission to use his material, and I certainly never did write anything about Seasilver in my Wednesday Letter. I cannot imagine that I would do as he says. In any event, I do not find any other reference in any of my 20,000 pages to Seasilver, except my derogatory comments.
I just never spend time on bulletin boards. The only exception to that was when I regularly read the postings of people who promoted eating only raw food -- never processed "food" such as Seasilver.
My diet suggestions, more than 2000 pages, include no recommendation by me for eating such things as Seasilver.
I just ran a search on more than 5,000 of my web pages, where I write about diet and stuff like David Friedman would write. His name does not appear in any page!
In fact, if you enter "Karl Loren" in the google search engine, you find 4,800+ hits, and if you place the name "David R. Friedman" in google, you get 196 hits. When you eliminate webs that promote Friedman because of Seasilver, the number of hits drops to 81. Then you scroll through those, not a single one, except one, deals with THIS David R. Friedman. The others are a business executive and a law firm with that name.
The one exception is where Dr. Friedman is promoting magnets to cure people. He really likes magnets!
Several studies conducted in this fascinating field
The following information is a recap of an article by David R. Friedman, ND, DC, that appeared in the April 1999 Edition of Clinical Chiropractic. It will give you an idea of the wide array of study being conducted and the positive results coming out of the research.ing to the added magnetic field. (source)
- An orthopedic surgeon at the University of Miami Medical placed a static magnet over the thumb of a patient where a bone graft had been set to surgically repair the hand. The thumb was stable within 5-1/2 weeks, compared to a normal fusion time of 8+ weeks. He attributed the accelerated heal
I guess that is all you can find about Dr. Friedman on the web.]
Mr. Loren praised my article, stating he was impressed with my statements regarding a whole food liquid product being more absorbed than synthetic vitamin pills. He also liked the idea that Seasilver could offer many whole food nutrients in one synergistic blend.
[Karl Note: This cannot be true. In my article about "natural vitamins" I make it clear that the word "natural" has no meaning, and next that most vitamins are NOT made from food. Vitamin C is prominently mentioned on that page. Virtually all Vitamin C sold in stores is "synthetic" since the cost of a so-called "natural" or plant source would be so exorbitantly high that no one would buy it. This man has proven that he lies by claiming that I said things to him which are no part of my thinking.]
He told me I was right in line with his beliefs and for me to “keep up the great work.”
[Karl Note: This is now obviously a lie!]
In this Seasilver article, that he praised, I also referenced page 1542 of the Physician's Desk Reference which shows that vitamin pills are only 10% absorbed. I also included proof as to how the human body absorbs liquids better than pills.
[Karl Note: It is very strange how he cannot put this page on his web site. Below he complains that I only looked for this page using Google. That is not true. I have my own printed copy of the PDR. Not only are his claims for absorption NOT in that book, but there is nothing like that subject covered in that book. Some drug company might have made a claim like this in writing about some other delivery system that they sell -- but I could not find any such either. I just doesn't exist!
If it does exist? Let him publish the exact text and exact reference. A "page number" is useless without a date for that book.]
Six years later, I see now that Mr. Loren has completely changed his views since praising my Seasilver article. In looking over his web site, it doesn't' take a rocket scientist to figure out why.
Mr. Loren is now heavily into the VITAMIN AND MINERAL PILL SELLING (AND MANUFACTURING) BUSINESS. His "Vibrant Life Products Page" sells over a dozen products that are in PILL form.
[Karl Note: Yes, indeed. I have been selling Vibrant Life vitamins for more than 20 years, no big secret about that.]
His negative rampage on Seasilver began after one of his customers mentioned to him that they were getting e-mailed information regarding Seasilver and were now questioning the efficacy of the pills Mr. Loren was endorsing and selling on his site.
His nasty Seasilver review would be analogous to the type of negative opinions the owner of Acuview contact lens corporation would give to a person that was asking his opinion on Lasik eye surgery.
Mr. Loren did not seem to base his negative comments on any documented research, but rather, they were simply the opinions of a man who (in his own words) “formulates his own vitamin pills.”
[Karl Note: The opinion was based exactly on the precise explanation I wrote. No hidden stuff here -- just a plain analysis of the claims made on the various web sites of Seasilver distributors.]
His statement that “Seasilver is a synthetic product” totally reveals his absolute ignorance regarding the product!! Every single ingredient in Seasilver is 100% natural and all of the minerals and vitamins are 100% PLANT DERIVED!! By definition, this is the complete opposite of being a “synthetic” (man made) product.
[Karl Note: Another stupid lie! All you have to do is read my page and look for the word "synthetic." That word does not exist as my writing. In fact, that word and that phrase do not exist anywhere on my page. David has made this up out of whole cloth.]
Sadly, Mr. Loren clearly proved that his negative statements were not toward Seasilver but rather to MLM companies selling nutritional products. In fact, he states:
“After I responded as above, I decided that I get a fair number
of queries on ‘Seasilver’ so I might as well do more research.
First I figured it must be an MLM.
I've done my research. This thing is a MLM deal”.I FIND IT RATHER ODD THAT HIS “RESEARCH” CONSISTED OF FINDING OUT WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS AN MLM PRODUCT AND THEN DOING A GOOGLE SEARCH TO SEE HOW MANY PAID SEASILVER MLM SITES THEY LISTED.
“ Even without looking I know that it is extremely high priced for
very little value, and that there will be outlandish claims that
are not scientific.”EVEN “WITHOUT LOOKING,” MR. LOREN MADE THIS ASSUMPTION?? HE HAS THE AUDACITY TO SAY THAT A PRODUCT THAT HAS EVERY VITAMIN, MINERAL, AMINO ACID AND ENZYME KNOWN TO MAN IS “COSTLY” WITH A RETAIL VALUE OF ONLY $39.95.
[Karl Note: Indeed I do say that it is costly. The actual amounts of the various vitamins is never shown. Instead the Seasilver people show a very deceptive "list" of nutrients, with no quantities:
VITAMINS
Food Matrix Source
Vitamin A
(Beta Carotene)
Vitamin B
(Complex)
Vitamin C
(Complex)
Vitamin D
Vitamin E
*Vitamin J-K-P
* Vitamin C Co-Factors
click here for more info
MACRO MINERALS
Food Matrix Source
Calcium
Magnesium
Phosphorus
Potassium
click here for more info
TRACE MINERALS
Food Matrix Source
Barium
Bismuth
Boron
Bromine
Cadmium
Cesium
Cerium
Chloride
Chromium
Cobalt
Copper
Fluorine
Gallium
Germanium
Gold
Indium
Iodine
Iridium
Iron
Lanthanum
Lithium
Manganese
Molybdenum
Nickel
Niobium
Osmium
Palladium
Platinum
Rhodium
Rubidium
Selenium
Silica
Silicon
Silver
Sodium
Strontium
Sulfur
Tellurium
Tin
Titanium
Tungsten
Uranium
Vanadium
Zinc
Zirconium
click here for more info
SOURCE
AMINO ACIDS
Food Matrix Source
**Isoleucine
**Leucine
**Lysine
**Methionine
**Phenylalanine
**Threonine
**Tryptophan
**Valine
Alanine
Arginine
Aspartic Acid
Citrulline
Cysteine
Cystine
Glutamic Acid
Glutamine
Glycine
Histidine
Ornithine
Proline
Serine
Taurine
Tyrosine
**Essential Amino Acids
click here for more info
ENZYMES
Food Matrix Source
Amylase
Cellulase
Lipase
Protease
click here for more info
These nutrients could be obtained from a bunch of weeds! That would not make them bad, but the point here is that many fraudulent vitamin companies list vitamins without showing quantities. Since this Seasilver fraud is NOT sold as a vitamin product, they are probably within the law to simply list them, not show, as the law requires, the quantity of each one when sold as a vitamin product.
The more I read the more of a fraud this stuff looks to be!]
He claims this price is “outrageous,” however, Mr. Loren sees fit to sell his Oral Chelation Formula for an astounding cost of $90!!
[Karl Note: Indeed, I sell one of my products for $90 per bottle. My product lists the 60 some ingredients, with the quantity for each. All you have to do is take a list of my ingredients, and quantities, and price them out in any health food store. You would find that my one capsule costs less than trying to buy each of the ingredients in any other product. The bottle is "expensive" in comparison to many very cheap vitamin products, but it still costs less than any other product or products with the same ingredients.
David may not agree with the quantities in my formula, but thousands of others do, and buy it.]
Mr. Loren “claims” this product will “improve a person’s blood circulation by removing free radicals and toxic metals.” When Seasilver makes similar claims, Mr. Loren calls it “junk science!”
[Karl Note: I have literally thousands of pages of scientific studies showing exactly what substances can remove metals from the body. There is no mystery here and no room for opinion. Only certain "chelating substances" remove metals, and there would have to be enough of those to do the job. Seasilver is a fraud, specifically, on this claim. They do not list N Acetyly Cysteine or EDTA at all, and there is no clue as to how much Cysteine their product contains. Even if it has as much as 100 mg per daily dosage, that would not be enough to chelate metals out of the body.]
Mr. Loren sells a product called “Crystal Energy®” which he claims acts as a carrier of all nutrients to the cells and the vehicle for the elimination of all toxins.
[Karl Note: Ah! David has caught me. I do have products for sale from two MLM companies. I detest MLMs just because they are mostly frauds and over-priced.
It is also true that since I have published 20,000 pages, and publish more every day, there are undoubtedly statements made by some others, not by me, about the two MLMs whose products I sell.
Altogether, my sales of products from these two companies are less than 1% of my total monthly sales, and the profits even less. One of these days I may just delete those pages, but a very small number of people find these products useful and I'm willing to provide them]
Sounds like (let me use the word he loves so much)........“psychobabble.” So, this “crystal” water removes ALL toxins and brings in ALL nutrients??
Using Karl Loren’s definition, would this product he sells not fall into the “junk science” category?? I could go on and on with the many “claims” stated on his web site but I won’t. When Seasilver lists similar claims, he calls it “fraudulent,” “non scientific” product propaganda!!
I found it also quite strange that in Mr. Loren’s “review” of Seasilver, he fails to MENTION ANY OF THE INGREDIENTS AT ALL! That would be like a movie critic basing his review solely on the movie title and who directed it, without watching the movie.
[Karl Note: Well, I've now mentioned the ingredients -- further proof of fraud since the quantities are not shown!]
He prejudged Seasilver the second he found out it was a network marketing company.
[Karl Note: That was certainly one of the indicators, but I have far more than MLM to find fraudulent in Seasilver.]
Eighty percent of his very lengthy Seasilver “investigation” was spent ridiculing network marketing companies. I think this is very hypocritical of Mr. Loren because he happens to recommend the product Transfer Factor, manufactured by 4 Life, A NETWORK MARKETING COMPANY! ( http://www.4-life.com/compensation)
He also sells a product called Microhydrin from Royal Body Care........ALSO A NETWORK MARKETING COMPANY! (http:www.royalbodycare.com/main.htm)
[Karl Note: Yes, as commented on above.]
Mr. Loren is the true example of “the pot calling the kettle black.” In fact, both of these MLM companies that he is endorsing, happens to offer a “free web site” which he so eloquently ridiculed SeasilveHealth.com for doing.
I have never seen a man talk so much out of both sides of his mouth. I guess he suffers from the “if I don’t sell it, it’s no good” disease. In his negative review on Seasilver he states the following:
“MLM companies cannot possibly sell anything you could find in a store because their profit margin must be so high that the selling price would be so much higher than the store that they would never sell. So, the only way an MLM can sell something is to claim that it is unique -- that you cannot find it anywhere else. If you want that unique product you will have to pay those very high prices for it."
[Karl Note: I notice that David makes no attempt to refute this truth!]
Very high prices?? Mr. Loren is selling a bottle of Calcium (one ingredient) for $70!! He is selling a bottle of Germanium (one ingredient) for $100.00!! He is selling a month’s supply of Transfer Factor (one ingredient) for a $58.95. ......and Mr. Loren says that the $39.95 cost for Seasilver (multiple ingredients) is high??
[Karl Note: Well, again, David is lying. My calcium formula has many ingredients. My germanium also has several ingredients, but it is also fascinating that there is not one other source of Germanium that has an honest source for their materials. I will soon be publishing an expose on this. Virtually all source of germanium sold in the US, now, are from China and do NOT meet the quality tests designed by the holder of the Germanium patent, in Japan. I spent several days researching Germanium, in Japan, and know this product very well. One of the "famous" sellers of germanium was accused by me of buying smuggled germanium. He attempted to sue me for slander and eventually gave up. Yes, the true germanium is very expensive, but you can always buy cheap forgeries!]
“Generally it is safe to conclude, with very little research, that any product being sold by any MLM is far over-priced and probably promoted in a deceptive way. Seasilver fits these criteria well.”
I do see one thing I agree with in the above statement and it is the words he used, “with very little research”.....because that is exactly what he did! Being a “well respected” journalist whose work is read by "ten thousand people per day," readers that put their trust in his opinions, I would think he would be beyond making such assumptions without data to back up his statements. Mr. Loren’s words just prove how truly prejudice and closed minded he is when writing his articles! He also states that testimonials on Seasilver’s web site are untrue and they make “OUTRAGEOUS CLAIMS.”
[Karl Note: The real truth here is that many readers of my weekly newsletter have thanked me profusely from helping them stay away from the several MLM frauds I have exposed. Incidentally, there are hundreds more of these frauds out there -- it is just a part time interest of mine to expose a few. My web sites get about 10,000 visitors per day -- some of them read about Seasilver. They have come to trust my pages for the truth!]
“ Many people FEEL BETTER even if they drink flavored water, so it is easy to get testimonials that sound sincere.”
He states that most testimonials are just the result of a placebo effect. Perhaps Mr. Loren needs to look at the “testimonial page” on his web site. These range from people stating that they have been “cured” from cancer, “cured” from heart disease, how his MSM product saved a person’s detached finger (oh boy, I would love to see some “scientific proof” on that claim!), varicose veins disappearing, kidney disease cures, blood pressure cures, etc. etc. I guess Mr. Loren is proof that the old statement is correct, if you point your finger at someone you have three of them pointing back at you!
[Karl Note: I publish interesting testimonials and do not require "proof" first. I've written about WHY a person would decide to buy something like a vitamin. Testimonials are part of it, and are often the ONLY thing offered by MLMs, and certainly by Seasilver. But there is more than testimonials needed. I have literally many thousands of scientific studies on many different subjects among my 20,000 pages.]
Ironically, in doing MY research, I found out that Mr. Loren not only sells MLM products but he is an active distributor for the network marketing companies 4 Life and RoyalBodyCare! In fact, he has his very own replicating MLM web site for 4Life!!
You can visit Mr. Loren’s PERSONAL 4 Life network marketing web site by going to:
http://www.supercolostrum.net/Mr. Loren is also an independent distributor for the network marketing company Royal Bodycare.
http://www.oralchelation.com/microhydrin/microhydrin13.htmIn his negative review of the independent Seasilver distributor’s site, he reveals his total negative feelings for MLM companies and how MLM companies produce “INFERIOR PRODUCTS.” I found this statement rather two faced after I learned that many of the nutrients he sells on his web site are MLM products.
On his web site ( http://www.oralchelation.com/vibrantlife/microhydrin.htm#marketing) Mr. Loren states the following:
The Marketing Opportunity
The Microhydrin has proven to be so exciting that Vibrant Life (Mr. Loren’s company) has been willing to get involved in this Multi Level Marketing Company. You may purchase Microhydrin direct from this web site, for shipment from the inventory maintained by Vibrant Life. The price here on this web site is the regular retail price for this product.
Remember, you cannot buy Microhydrin from Vibrant Life for $35.00 per bottle. Vibrant Life ONLY sells this product at the regular retail price of $46.00 per bottle. If you are interested in the wholesale price, you must become a distributor for the product.
You can become a distributor with Royal BodyCare immediately and be sponsored by Vibrant
Life. Those sponsored by Vibrant Life will, if they wish, have pages WITHIN this web site,
showing their name and other information. Those who do this will have a direct web address for their pages, and can use these pages to help introduce others to Microhydrin and other Royal BodyCare products.
If you are ready to "sign up" now, you can do that directly. Give them the above Vibrant Life distributor number (140428), and become a distributor immediately. You would be
sponsored directly by Vibrant Life if you do this.
You can THEN let us know if you would like to have a section of web pages, within this web site. This would be web section with an address which you could use to give to your friends so that they can learn about Microhydrin. This section is now available for those already signed up as distributors sponsored by Vibrant Life[Karl Note: To my knowledge I have less than 10 downline, and probably less. I've never tried to recruit distributors. If someone wants to be one, OK. I have no distributors for whom I have created web pages, as far as I know -- certainly nothing in recent years.]
..............So, let the truth be told! Mr. Loren offers a “replicating” MLM web site, yet in his review he totally bashes Seasilver for doing this! I guess it’s okay for HIS network marketing company to offer this, but when Seasilver does it, he calls it fraudulent.
[Karl Note; A replicating web site is no where on my pages, nor have I assisted anyone to make any. Yes, I have a made-up site with 4Life Research, but that is not worth the pennies to keep it published. My own web site for 4Life has more information about the immune system than you will find anywhere in the world, and none of it came from 4Life. I think Transfer Factor is a valuable product, and take is personally. Because 4Life has the patent, no one else can sell this stuff. It may well be high priced, but then it is not available anywhere else!]
He totally degrades companies whose web sites tell people they can reach financial independence. In the negative Seasilver review Mr. Loren states:
“ If you take your time spent, and the earnings, more than 90% of the people who get into any MLM wind up earning less than $5.00 per hour for their time....... So, don't think you will be rich. products who’s web sites state things like ‘Get Rich’...... ‘Earn extra money.’ etc. etc.” Mr. Loren unequivocally states his ill feelings for network marketing companies that mislead people by stating how they can “get rich.” He says that most people that join MLM companies do not make money and these claims are totally deceptive and misleading to innocent victims that fall pray to such promises of reaching “financial independence.”THE TWO FACES OF KARL LOREN STRIKES AGAIN:
On Mr. Loren’s very own INDEPENDENT 4 LIFE WEB SITE, it states:
“I have enjoyed a substantial income for years in my medical practice; I'm going to be able to
replace that income dollar for dollar and more with 4Life™."Robert Robertson, Jr., M.D.
International Diamond“ The strengths of the 4Life Research compensation plan provide an
ultimate opportunity for business builders to gain financial security
and time freedom at any level they desire. To understand how your
financial goals can be achieved continue reading. Our Rapid Reward Program
enables new distributors to start earning money right away.”
JR4 Life Website
http://www.breakthroughteam.info/opportunity.htmlThe 4-Life opportunity has enabled me to create a six-figure income each year
and a lifestyle that previously was beyond my imagination.PR
Life Website
http://www.shapefast.com/seekadin.htmlAfter 3 years of doing this part time, we were earning a six-figure income, and I decided to leave
the practice of law to devote my full-time efforts to building our flourishing business.
JH
4 Life Website
http://www.shapefast.com/seekadin.html
“Before I got involved with Royal BodyCare, I was over $100,000 in debt while only making
$15,000 a year as a financial planner. Now, that I am FINANCIALLY SECURE thanks to my RBC
business, I actually have the time to enjoy life. As a matter of fact, for our 10 year anniversary
we went to Hawaii for a whole month and when we came back our check was higher than the
month before! This is a great business to help yourself and others."- J. Keller
RoyalBodyCare Website
http://www.royalbodycare.com/default.htm
[Karl Note: I have no idea if the above statements are realistic. I would never make them, and when I went looking for them on my web site, most of them were not to be found. It appears that David has lied again -- he got quotes from RBC, not from MY web site. This is deception, but not surprising. Yes, RBC makes these claims, but I would never endorse them.]
Another reason Mr. Loren says Seasilver is a “fraudulent” product is because we have “Proprietary” ingredients in the product and he says, “this is a common claim for MLM products. And it is just stated so you can’t compare the prices.” I got some sad news for Mr. Loren. Let’s go make a visit to his 4 Life personal Independent Distributor web site and see how the product that he endorses called Transfer Factor is described:
4Life is Patented. Proprietary. Profitable. The wise
selection of dietary supplements, such as
Transfer Factor and Transfer Factor Plus, is
one of the most important things you can do
to achieve optimal health. 4Life concentrates
on providing the highest quality, scientifically
formulated products based on proprietary
and patented ingredients.[David is absolutely right. 4Life Research uses its proprietary ingredients to justify its price. There is no way of knowning how outrageous the 4Life prices are, but I don't care. If you want Transfer Factor, then 4Life is the only honest source -- whether the prices are outrageous or not!]
So, I guess it looks like the product Mr. Loren endorses, profits from and recommends to ten thousand people per day in his “Wednesday Letter” is a “proprietary” product. I guess that means, according to MR. LOREN’S words (which I am sure he is eating right now)...Transfer Factor must be a bogus product because they wont reveal their “secret” ingredients.
If Mr. Loren is such an “expert” on nutrition, then I am shocked that he does not believe in the healing abilities of SEA VEGETABLES, PAU D’ ARCO AND COLD PROCESSED ALOE VERA (the key ingredients in Seasilver.)
[Karl Note: I certainly know more about Pau D' Arco (Taheebo) than most people and I know that virtually every source of Taheebo I've ever seen is a fraud. Here is a comment from a Seasilver page:
Seasilver also contains Pau D' Arco. South American Indians call the tree tajy, which means 'to have strength and vigor' and use the bark to treat many different conditions. Pau D' Arco has been used for hundreds of years and is labeled by the most renowned nutritionists as the best natural blood purifier and lymphatic cleanser.
[Karl Note: Seasilver claims to have "quadruple strength" Pau d' Arco, but there is no explanation of what that means. My own pau d' arco has a very explicit description of how the bark of the tree is extracted and extracted, without heat. Seasilver admits that it boils the water in which it makes the pau d' arco tea. Boiling damages the delicate components of the bark. The natives in South America most often "brewed" this tea without boiling water -- but only by soaking.]
In America, studies show Pau D' Arco acts as an analgesic, antioxidant, antiparasitic, antimicrobial, antifungal, anti-viral, antibacterial, anti-inflammatory and laxative. It has been proven to be effective externally and internally for the treatment of fevers, infections, colds, flu, syphilis, respiratory problems, gastrointestinal problems of all kinds, arthritis and circulatory disturbances.
Dr. John Heinennan, a medical anthropologist who specializes in studying herbal medicines, says, "Pau D' Arco seems to have earned for itself considerable merit for the successful treatment of diabetes and certain other debilitating diseases... " (source)I sell a concentrated extract of the bark. This is only way it is useful. It is, of course, useful as a tea, but that is simply an extract, although very weak and not concentrated.
Oh that’s right, he never even got to the ingredients of the product during his “research” on Seasilver. I guess the ingredients weren’t an important issue once he found out that Seasilver was a competing MLM company for the network marketing companies he profits from.
Perhaps his negative review may have been fueled by the concern that he might lose some of his Royal BodyCare downline to Seasilver?? I guess as we dig deeper, some pretty selfish motives become apparent. He stated in his report that Seasilver’s claim to "strengthen the immune system,” is a “meaningless term” and is simply a “buzz word” used to promote MLM products.
[Karl Note: As far as I know I have NO downline, and could care less if there were a few and they left. As I wrote above, these MLMs I'm involved with account for less than 1% of my monthly business -- which is very large in the products which I formulated myself.]
Mr. Loren happens to sell Pau D’ Arco on his web site. I guess when it comes to HIS Pau D’ Arco product, it’s okay to tell people that it “strengthens the immune system” but when it comes to Seasilver’s Pau D’ Arco, he considers this a “meaningless” statement and strictly sales hype.
[Karl Note: I have the honest Pau d' Arco, while Seasilver puts no description of the form of their claimed Pau d' Arco. They admit to boiling the bark, but there is no further description.]
I think Karl Loren should change his career from a “Prolific Researcher, Author and Philosopher” to the title of VENTRILOQUIST.......... because I have never seen any man talk so well out of both sides of his mouth!
.
It is obvious that the supposed “RESEARCH” he did on Seasilver was SOLELY just going to the Seasilverhealth.com site (maxhealth.) If he calls that research, he is a disgrace to journalism! He did not request any information on the research supporting the healing properties of Seasilver’s cold processed aloe vera, quadruple strength pau d’ arco or the ten sea vegetable’s used in the product. He is quick to call Seasilver’s formulator Bela Berkes “fraudulent” on his site yet he never once called him to learn about the “proprietary manufacturing methods” used to produce Seasilver, that Mr. Loren so belittles in his review.In other words, this “expert on nutrition” PRE JUDGED Seasilver without doing any research. He states in his review his strong disbelief regarding the “claims” he has read such as Seasilver’s ability to make people feel better, strengthen their immune system, reduce weight and improve digestion and so on and so on, however, Mr. Loren offers similar claims for his MLM products.
If his opinion is true and Seasilver does none of these things, then I ask you............how is it that Seasilver orders have quadrupled in the past few months?
[Karl Note: This is extremely common in the early phrases of MLMs. They start to grow at a certain point because the frantic distributors are hyping the product all over the place, hoping to make millions without working. Then all MLMs start to slow down. The honest ones will last, but the dishonest ones go out of business in a few years. Seasilver will not last long!]
How is it that Seasilver has an 81+% repurchase rate?
[Karl Note: No surprise at all! Most MLMs pay commissions based on fake sales and inventory building.]
If Mr. Loren’s statement was true, that Seasilver does none of the aforementioned health benefits, how are we still in business (and growing every month)?? Americans are not stupid. They will not pay their hard earned money on something month after month that doesn’t work, especially considering today’s poor economy. I guess Mr. Loren is calling the millions of people claiming benefits from Seasilver all lairs. I would say he is pretty outnumbered. Many years ago, I used to sell the VERY EXPENSIVE product Microhydrin (the MLM product Mr. Loren endorses. ) After seeing less than a 10% repurchase rate, I stopped carrying it.
Considering Mr. Loren has never even tried Seasilver, does he really have the right to speak negatively about the product? Do movie critics give a negative review on a movie they didn’t see? Does a food critic give his critique of a restaurant without eating there? How can Mr. Loren base his opinion on Seasilver, from only visiting the internet site of an independent Seasilver distributor? Had Mr. Loren tried Seasilver, then maybe I would have a little more respect for his “opinion” of the product. Had Mr. Loren not been a VITAMIN PILL SALESMAN (and formulator,) I would also respect his opinion more. Had he not been building a downline with another MLM company, I may believe his motives were unbiased in his Seasilver review. I have always believed that if a person has a MOTIVE for a negative review..........then take it with a grain of salt!
In Mr. Loren’s negative review on Seasilver, he closes by saying that the PDR reference regarding the “10 % absorption” of vitamin pills was fabricated. He says (and I quote):
“ It would be enough for me to denounce them as complete frauds -- to either invent data, not in existence where they say it is, or to mislead viewers as to where the chart actually came from.”
Mr. Loren sated that he did “extensive research” yet he could not find page 1542 of the PDR.. He states that his “research” consisted of doing an internet search on the “google” search engine. Because google didn’t have a link to page 1542 of the PDR, Mr. Loren says that it was made up. I guess Mr. Loren needs to be introduced to a place outside of “GOOGLE” to do his future research.........it’s called the LIBRARY!
Perhaps if he had gone there, he would have found the issue of the Physician's Desk Reference that shows that vitamins in a pill form are indeed just “10% absorbed.” That actual page is included in this e-mail for your review. I guess his theory about Seasilver “making up this information” was wrong......just like his ENTIRE negative review on the product!
I hope this information is helpful. Feel free to pass it along to any Seasilver distributor that, for some reason, puts credibility to Mr. Loren’s very biased opinions.
Sincerely,
David R. Friedman, B.S., N.D., D.C
CC: Karl Loren
Subject: Questions raised by Karl Loren
Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:42:52 EST
From: ChicagoSeasilver@aol.com
To: DocNeuro@bellsouth.net
Dr. Friedman,
Brett suggested I forward this question to you. I was putting all my ducks in a row getting ready to invest a lot of time and money in Seasilver and then one of my customers showed me this link by Karl Loren Karl Loren. The most disturbing part was what he says below concerning the Physician's Desk Reference because it is in almost all the information you sent me. Has anyone at Seasilver disputed this guy?
Dear Dan, you see that the refutations are just more fraud. NOT one person has published an actual page from the PDR with the claim made by David. In my opinion he is a fraud.]
Please advise. Thank you.
Dan Yelovich
My comments are as above, in blue.
Karl Loren
Karl Note: Here is another person who was defrauded by Seasilver. You who read this? Have a duty to tell your friends to use some common sense and refuse to swallow the false claims and psychobabble of the Seasilver people!
-----Original Message-----
From: Angela
Sent: Monday, June 30, 2003 11:07 AM
To: extract2@oralchelation.com
Subject: Message to Karl Loren from the Chelation Therapy On Line Home
Section
Dear Karl, I've written you twice before, a few weeks ago. I mentioned to you
that I had just ordered some Seasilver to try out for the first time. I was
very anxious to try the product because everything I had read about it sounded
great. The reason I am writing you is to tell you about my experience with it,
and to also give you a little background info about my personal situation.
Several years ago, I was diagnosed with active mononucleosis. The mono stayed
active for an entire year and seriously damaged my immune system. During that
year I did lots of reasearch on vitamins, nutrition, etc. to find out what I
needed to do in order to regain my health and strengthen my immune system. I
will tell you that I was very surprised at how little the doctors apparently
knew about how to help me. Not one doctor that I saw even mentioned that I
would need extra nutrition or cautioned me on what foods I should avoid or eat
more of. When I changed the way I ate and started supplementing my diet with
different nutritional products, I finally started feeling like myself again.
Not only that, but I felt better than I ever in my life had! I tried many
different brands and many different types of supplements and they all helped me
and made me feel significantly better, all to varying degrees. My point is, I'm
very accustomed to noticing how the supplements I'm taking are affecting me and
if they are truly helping or not. I have recently had somewhat of a relapse and
wanted to try out the Seasilver since what I had read about it sounded so good.
I started on the Seasilver about 2, maybe 2 1/2 weeks ago, initially taking the
highest recommended dosage of 4 ounces a day, then increasing slowly, as it
appeared not to be having any affect on me whatsoever. I did, however, notice
that I had more gas than usual and also my neck and torso broke out in a rash.
The rash went away after several days, but the gas has stayed the same. I
assumed that the rash was simply a cleansing reaction and that my body was
detoxing. I am now starting on my third bottle of Seasilver (after finishing
two of the bottles in about 2 weeks), and I feel no better now than I did before
I started taking it. Every product that I have EVER taken has given me results
in less than a week, sometimes in as little as 2-3 days, even the mediocre
products. I am very disappointed to state the least.
After receiving my Seasilver by mail and reading the
label, I realized that the amounts of the vitamins, minerals, etc. are not
listed. They gave an explanation of this in the literature they sent, but I
couldn't understand how they could offer a recommended daily dosage if they
don't even know how much of each nutrient is in the product. I contacted my
distributor and asked him this question before I started on the product and he
still has not gotten back with me. I suppose it is possible that the Seasilver
is composed of the ingredients that they say it is, I guess we would never know
either way, but what I think is probably the case is that the amounts of each
nutrient in the Seasilver are so tiny that you would have to drink in excess of
a whole bottle or more a day just to get an average amount of nutrition. I will
definitely not use this product again and I hope that I can save others from
wasting their money on this product as well. If it's not making you feel better
then how would you ever have any way of knowing if you are getting the nutrition
they claim is in their product? Sincerely, A.
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