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Table Of Contents

More On Prayer -- And The Place For God Relative To Vitamins!

How about YOUR question here?

Read below or choose another question.

Related Page Here

Are These Vitamins Natural?	Oral chelation means taking Cysteine or EDTA through the mouth
Is This MLM?	Where Can I Learn About Cysteine?
Do Viruses Cause Disease?	Where Can I Learn About Niacin?
Why Do People Take Vitamins?	What About Prayer?
What Is Oral Chelation?	EDTA Compared With Cysteine
What Is Fraudulent Taheebo?	What Is This Niacin Flush?
Why So Critical Of The AHA?	What About Black Walnut As An Oral Chelation Nutrient?
How Long Should I Take Life Glow Plus, What Results Can I Expect?	Why Should I buy your product when there are many others available at lower prices?
My Hands Have Gotten Warmer!	Does Life Glow Plus Lower Cholesterol? What if my cholesterol goes UP after taking Life Glow Plus?
What About Coumadin?	Karl Loren: What Are Your Credentials For These Claims?
What Are The Mechanics Of Chelation Therapy?	What Does Karl Loren Recommend For Diet?
Will Taking ZOLOFT Interfere With Taking Life Glow Plus?	Why Does The FDA Do What It Does?
Can Oral Chelation Prevent Or Cure Cancer?	Where Do The Colostrum Cows Come From?
Can Phenylalanine Cause High Blood Pressure?	Is Dilantin Dangerous?
Prescription Drugs Are Now The #4 Killer!	ADD In Kids?
Karl, would you please listen to this cassette tape?	How Is Drug Marketing Changing?
Karl, I feel tired all the time!	Useful Role Of The FDA?
How Do You Treat Dog Bites?	What About Tobacco
Help Me Get My Son Off Cytoxin	What If You Take Less Than The Recommended Dose?
What Is A Good Cleansing Program	Ritalin The Schoolyard Killer
How Can A Doctor Commit Murder and Get Away With It?	What Is The Shelf Life Of Your Vitamins
Do You Have Independent Labs Test Your Ingredients?	What About Human Growth Hormone? HGH?
For Your Transfer Factor? Where Do The Cows Come From? How Healthy?	Another Chelation Doctor Proves His Ignorance of how EDTA works -- Dr. Whitaker
Complexity Leads To Death -- Simplicity Leads To Life	This Woman Is Doomed!
What is the VERY BEST Schedule For Taking Your Oral Chelation Capsules	Karl, What About The Calcium Deposits In My Breasts? Microcalcification?
What Can I Do About My Bent Penis -- Peyronie's Disease	Do Viruses Cause Disease?
The Mechanics of HOW Chelation Works	The "heated cholesterol" Fraud?
They Want Me To Get Tested! What Should I do?	Muscle Testing -- Kinesiology -- Valid Or Not?
Dr. Julian Whitaker Claims Oral Chelation Is No Good! What Do You Say?	What About Seasilver? Or The Latest MLM?
The Q2 Machine: Mysterious Science Pulls In Greedy Suckers	What About Coral Calcium? Mr. Barefoot?
Milk! The (Now) Dangerous Food!	How To Tell If MSM Is The Real Stuff!
Comparing Clathration with Chelation	Is It True? That You Refuse To Sell Anything To Anyone Taking Certain Drugs?
Can Chelation Cause Mercury To MOVE From The Body INTO The Brain?	How Can I Buy Cheap EDTA?
Low Body Temperature -- Wilson's Syndrome	How Can I Help Persuade My Friend To Use Alternative Methods?
Formatting Karl's Newsletter?	I'm A Reporter. Will You Help Me With My Story?
What Is The Vibrant Life Guarantee?	Karl Loren's Advice About Diabetics
What Are The Vibrant Life Purposes?	What is the Mohs Procedure For Skin Cancer
The Bio terrorism Act Of 2002 -- The Beginning Of The Need For Recognition of Change	Acid Reflux Esophageal Cancer
Mental Causation Of Heart Disease	My Husband Just Had A Massive Heart Attack In The ER!
Oral Chelation Frauds	What Treats Autism?

-----Original Message-----
From: root (System Administrator) [mailto:root (System Administrator)]
Sent: Monday, July 29, 2002 10:30 PM
To: extract2@oralchelation.com
Subject: Message to Karl Loren from the Chelation Therapy On Line Home Section

*******************************************************************************
Source:                Chelation Therapy On Line Home Section
Contact_FirstName:     Steve
Contact_LastName:      Coffman
Contact_MiddleInitial: L

Dear Karl,

I read your web page with great interest-I am a firm believer in beloved "C" and have consumed at least 10,000 mg./day since 1979; I have written a book about C I call Ezekiel's Medicine. It lays bare the slander and nonsense about C; and why the govt and the media continue to smear, deny, and dismiss Pauling(s) and others claims. However, I give credit and basis for what I say to the 182 M.D.'s and other professionals I have found who champion C, and also to the Bible. Yes, vitamin C is found in the Bible! I invite you to communicate with me; I could talk for hours about C and stunning triumphs of what it has done for me and my wife in my lifetime.

But the essence of my claims about C is simply to give real credit for its existence to the one who created it-God. God created vitamin C and it bears His handiwork marks. The very nature of C bears a resemblance to the Lord Jesus Christ.

If you are not a Christian person, this may be strange to you; but since your web page champions the admitted underdog cause, why not at least consider that:

Every flesh animal in the world )billions) makes C by the gram; a 150 lb goat makes 13g/day. Humans and six others are the only ones on Earth who do not function this way. In Ezekiel's Medicine, I document the Bible/scriptural reason for this; and the medical denial and coverup of it.

The above fact is a death blow to those who proclaim that
C is not necessary or advisable in concentrations above 500mg. Ditto for those who claim hi levels of C damage DNA or cause kidney stones, gallstones, or liver damage.

Well, I've said enough for now. I invite your response.

Sincerely yours,
Steve Coffman
vitac@megalink.net

--- Original Message -----

From: Karl Loren

To: vitac@megalink.net

Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 1:51 AM

Subject: RE: Message to Karl Loren from the Chelation Therapy On Line Home Section

Dear Steve,

I always respond to personal messages.

You are preaching.

I don't disagree, but don't respond to preaching.

Regards,

Karl

-----Original Message-----
From: SteveC [mailto:vitac@megalink.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 12:25 PM
To: karl@karlloren.com
Subject: Re: Message to Karl Loren from the Chelation Therapy On Line Home Section

Dear Karl;

I admit to being perhaps a bit forceful;

but go to http://www.internetwks.com/pauling/

and read the contents of the Pauling/Rath

theory on Heart Disease. This is dynamite;

it could eradicate heart disease and save

millions. My father died from cancer;

my father in law died from a heart attack.

A good machinist friend of mine says he

can't eat eggs because his doctor forbid them.

There it is; nonsense right in my own back

yard. I am going to update my book and

add lysine to the text. Your web page does

a lot of knuckle pounding; if you don't think

this is worth a little preaching, I'm sorry.

God invented vitamin C; I will give Him

the credit He deserves even if no one

else does.

Steve C.

----- Original Message -----

From: Karl Loren

To: 'SteveC'

Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 1:03 AM

Subject: RE: Message to Karl Loren from the Chelation Therapy On Line Home Section

Dear Steve.

Yours is STILL not a personal message, but an attempt to get me to agree with you on something. I am taking the trouble to respond because you have obviously not looked at my 20,000 pages, many about Pauling.

Have you not seen my article about cholesterol???

You may preach about Pauling, but my formula is far superior -- good luck.

I have not gone to look, but I may well have more up-to-date information about Pauling than you have seen anywhere else.

Here are references on my web sites: (in the original message -- (about 20 pages omitted here)

Some of those pages include personal communications between me and one of those who is carrying forward Dr. Pauling's work now. He has "admitted" some things that you should read.

Next, here is a quote from Dr. Pauling, about intravenous chelation therapy -- you probably have never seen:

"A reference book such as this, which assembles a large body of scientific knowledge about EDTA chelation therapy into one volume, will be of great advantage to physicians who desire to learn more about this emerging nonsurgical treatment for atherosclerosis and related age-associated diseases."

-- Nobel laureate Linus Pauling, PhD.

My page at: http://www.chelationtherapyonline.com/articles/p203.htm

Karl Loren

-----Original Message-----
From: SteveC [mailto:vitac@megalink.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2002 12:15 AM
To: karl@karlloren.com
Subject: Hi Karl

Dear Karl;

I reviewed your web site

and many of the articles

about the AHA and Pauling;

you certainly have done

your homework in exposing

the fraud that is going on;

good work!

However, I continue to offer

my small viewpoint that,

we should first give credit

where credit is due.

If you love vitamin C and

hate the evil slander as

I do, give credit to God.

He invented C and everything

else.

My book gives credit where

credit is due; to God.

If you scan all the information

about supplements, lysine,

C, chelation, etc they boil down

into two catagories; supporting

because of some researcher, or aginst

because of some traditional

establishment medicine. I think

you agree on this point.

No one says anything about the

Creator of the Universe-God.

Doesn't he get some credit for

inventing this stuff in the first

place. I seem to be the only

one saying, "Lets give God the

credit for vitamin E, or C, or

whatever. No one else is doing

that today. Modern society has

kicked God out of the classroom,

the courtroom, the media, the

hospital, etc. When we get back

to worshiping and thanking God,

we will finally be on the right track

to fixing our lied to society. Until

then, all the claims, studies, and

evidence against the AMA and ACS

will be just whitewash. People will

continue to listen to their doctor tell

them to take Lipitor until someone tells

them to take what God has in mind

instead of the mind of man. God's

viewpoint is rejected today, but in

the end it will be all that is left standing.

"Heaven and earth shall pass away,

but My Words will never pass away.

If this is preaching, well, the preaching

of the Word of God is to them who

perish foolishness; I Cor 1:18, but

unto us who are saved it is the

power of God. Examine your heart;

are you for God or against Him?

May the Lord give you wisdom here.

"For God so loved the world that He

gave His only begotten Son, that

whosoever believeth in Him should

not perish but have everlasting life.

John 3:16.

Steve C.

Dear Steve,

You wrote:

If you scan all the information

about supplements, lysine,

C, chelation, etc they boil down

into two catagories; supporting

because of some researcher, or aginst

because of some traditional

establishment medicine. I think

you agree on this point.

The beginning is logical. Supplements are supported by research, but your continuation is not logical. Supplements are attacked, also, because of research.

What you bring up is that there are also non-scientific claims of either good or of bad for supplements (or many other things too.) Thus, some have said that Vitamin C is good because God made it (but did not make Prozac). Or, if you want to continue this logic, you could say that Prozac is bad because God didn't make it. Or, you could get more authoritarian and say that "meat" is bad because the Bible says this.

These above arguments are not Science. You may believe in God, or the Bible, or the inspired word of someone, but all of these methods of proving or disproving the value of something are based on authority, not logic and science.

So, I do not agree that ONLY traditional establishment medicine is the sole source of "against" supplements. '

There can certainly be science and logic that prove that some "supplement" is worthless, or harmful.

What is clear however is that I reject authoritarian claims for something being either good or bad. Authority is a bad source of logic or science.

The problem with using God as an authority is that God is a spiritual or non-material entity -- the only source of "opinions" or "truth" arising from God come only from man. No matter how inspired you might think some man is, or some human group, they are NOT God, and though they may speak for God, they are NOT God.

There is certainly plenty of evidence and precedent for some "man" speaking for God, only to discover that the information thus promulgated is withdrawn in the face of logic and science.

Thus, not too many years ago the Church said the earth was flat -- and burned people at the stake for heresy when they disagreed with "God's word as spoken by the Church." Then, when the Church had to reverse itself and say that the earth is not flat, it was surely evident that God could not be wrong about this, so the group that said what "God said" must have NOT been speaking for God, but for themselves.

This is the problem of using God as a proof of the value of a supplement.

There is no way TOWARD God except in your own heart and soul (which you can do as you wish, and believe what you find) OR OR OR TOWARD God by accepting the word of some MAN or group of men.

I surely believe in God, but I do not find any group, or any human who I think has a better path toward God than I do.

Jesus? We have only the words of MEN, not Jesus, since there was no camera and no tape recorder available. You may well feel that Jesus is God, or part of God, or whatever, but again we can have our own communication with Jesus, indeed, but when some MAN or group tells me that Jesus favored Vitamin C (??) I know that I am hearing a human voice, not the voice of Jesus.

You Steve, seem to feel that YOU, a human, have a special understanding of God, and you want others to accept YOUR understanding of God.

I do not accept that as logic or guidance for my life.

I do believe in God, as I've said, but I find that my own understanding of God is the ONLY understanding that has any validity. As I say that I believe in God, I also believe in the power of prayer -- but I do not accept that some HUMAN can tell me how to pray. Read my article on prayer by clicking here.

I would accept that God made the physical universe, and created "man" but it is only man's opinion, after that, that God made Vitamin C and did not make Prozac, for instance.

God made all the physical elements and set the planet on its course of growing things from the soil and sea.

But man would still be in the age of "hunters and gatherers" if he did not try to "improve" on the growing and farming of the soil and sea.

God did not create bread except in the sense off creating wheat. Man took the wheat and created bread. Man has also taken the wheat and created LSD.

God has a place in the life of every person, but that place needs to be defined by that person's relationship with God, not your understanding of God instead.

So, I use science and logic on Pauling's formula and it comes up lacking -- it lacks in its understanding of the role played by free radicals.

Any claim for health, or disease, which must ignore science in favor of some "man's" opinion of the word of God? That would be a claim based on the authority of a human, not the authority of truth and logic.

You are like many others -- using emotion rather than logic, using authoritarianism rather than science. I accept God, but I do NOT accept YOUR opinion of what God has said or done!

Good luck with your approach.

Karl Loren

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Special Pages On The Various of Web Sites Authored by Karl Loren
OC History	Oral Chelation		Testimonials
Family Of Three Oral Chelation Formulas	Life Glow Basic		Life Glow Basic Ingredient List
Life Glow Plus	Life Glow Plus Ingredient List		American Heart Association -- Lies
Super Life Glow	Super Life Glow Ingredient List		FAQ
All Products	Shopping Cart Order Section		Research
Taheebo Life Tea	Witch Doctors Versus Harvard		MSM Sulfur
Calcium	How Bones Grow		Colloidal Minerals
Jean Ross	Philosophy		The Wednesday Letter
Arthritis & James Coburn's Use Of MSM	Karl Loren Viewpoints		News And Announcements
Dr. Flanagan's Microhydrin	500 Page Book On Heart Disease		Colostrum & Transfer Factor
Germanium	Ultrasound Technology		Bulk MSM
Cancer & Biopsy	Diabetes		Heart Disease & Bypass Surgery
Karl Loren's Diet	Guarantee		Navigation Help Page
The Links Below Jump To Pages On Whatever Web You Are In
Table Of Contents	Search This Web		Navigation Help Page
Write To Karl Loren -- He Pledges To Answer EVERY Personal Message, Personally. Click here or on his name in the box below.
The Links Below Are To Various Web Sites Published By Karl Loren
Karl Loren Web	Vibrant Life Web		Karl Loren's Book
Super Colostrum	Bulk MSM		Heart Disease
Emmessar	Happiness		Arthritis
Instead Of	Chelation Therapy		Super Colostrum (2)
Immune Egg		Central Page For All Web Sites!

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More On Prayer -- And The Place For God Relative To Vitamins!

What Treats Autism?

My page at: http://www.chelationtherapyonline.com/articles/p203.htm

Send your question to Jean Ross here: